Nooooooooooooooooooo!

[vilakins]

Oh crap. Apparently they are going to remake Blake's 7. I daresay it will be 'gritty' and the characters changed out of all recognition and everyone will take it up as a new fandom.

I can hardly wait.

[Edit] Since so many people are telling me I'm negative, I shall point out that it's B7E I'm negative about. They've changed the characters and universe (come on, a populated galaxy in 200 years?) in their audio series and will do the same in a TV series.

If someone else were remaking B7 with say Martin Freeman as Vila and Dylan Moran as Avon, I'd be excited.

Comments

[zoefruitcake.livejournal.com]

Like they did with Battlestar Galactica...

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I never saw the old one but I gather people who did hated the new one.

[redscharlach.livejournal.com]

If it's any comfort, it's being made by a channel that very few people watch (and that I don't even have), with little track record at making drama series, so I can't foresee huge popularity, regardless of the actual product they turn out.

Then again, strange things sometimes happen...

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

To get me, they'd have to make at least one of the characters lovable and they didn't do that in the audio plays. In fact the OOC-ness and bad Foley work drove me off.

[sallymn.livejournal.com]

We can only hope. These people have been making the lives of B7 fans miserable for years with all their ghastly plans and stupid suggestions, I was rather hoping they'd gone bankrupt...

[quarryquest.livejournal.com]

I feel your pain!

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

Thanks!

You have SG1 to console yourself with though. It takes a lot to make me love something enough to want to write for it.

[glittermouse.livejournal.com]

I am in a world of horror.

As far as I know, though, it's being made by Sky One - which can't be described as 'a channel very few people watch', surely?

[redscharlach.livejournal.com]

Sorry, I was probably exaggerating a bit there! It may be sour grapes over the fact that they are also producing the new version of Gladiators, meaning that I won't get the cheesy men-in-lycra fix I would have got if it had been on ITV. ;-)

[san-valentine.livejournal.com]

Very definitely in 'wait and see' mode.

It could be good - the biggest weakness of the original is how unspecial the special effects are. It largely depends on what they chose to do with the characters. If they realize the series was popular because of its flawed heroes, great. If they try to glamourize them....

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure they'll do the opposite: make them hardened criminals and terrorists, then kill them all because that's what terrorists get.

[executrix.livejournal.com]

I'd be more upset if the threat hadn't been raised and been dissipated so often before.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

You're more optimistic than me then. It sounds as if they're going to use the audio play actors: Scottish, American, an Avon without wit and a Vila who sounds like a chain-smoking descendent of Fagan.

[kalinda001.livejournal.com]

I share your pain. Be afraid...be very very afraid...

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

You may have noted that I am.

[snowgrouse.livejournal.com]

Yeah. Fuck. I saw that. ARGH. The pain. The pain. And then n00bs will claim it's much better than the old series and old fans are just grumpy old moaners. Probably because it'll have more on-screen 'shipping and very anvilly plots that are trying very hard to be Gritty and Contemporary.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

And none of the character quirks that make us love them--at least what I heard of the new audio plays didn't. And unlike Tennant, the actors they use don't even bother to change their accents.

We'll be marginalised the way I assume the old BSG fans are. I wouldn't mind so much if it was a continuation like DW, but they're going to change people I like into other people altogether.

[babel.livejournal.com]

I can't imagine many fans of the original show will abandon it for the new thing. More likely, fans of the new thing will try out the old show and some of them will like it.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure; will they? Would people who like the gritty US-style politics of the new BSG go for the old one (which I admit I haven't seen)? I can quite see people seeking out old B7 if the new one was a continuation like DW, but why bother if it's a complete remake? All they'll see is bad SFX and not enough editing. :-(

[sorsha-khan.livejournal.com]

Ah. I really should check LJ before Facebook. Have just sent you a BBC link about B7 remake...
Am well aware a remake will almost certainly be a disaster; but, but... just can't seem get beyond the idea of MORE B7 :-D

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

More is not always good. Listen to the crappy audio plays--and it's the same people doing the TV. They are not our characters.

[jhall1.livejournal.com]

This seems rather a pessimistic way of looking at things. I had dire forebodings about New Who, but - though there have been plenty of niggles - on the whole I've enjoyed it.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

DW is different--he's the same character regenerated and having new adventures. They're not rewriting his old ones.

[britgeekgrrl.livejournal.com]

Fuck, fuck, fuck. I was hoping that Sci-Fi would be the co-sponsor, as they were on the audio dramas. God only knows what fuckwittery Sky One will impose when they sign the checks.

I know you weren't at all keen on the new audios but... *shrug* I think they could have been a LOT worse.

And, if the audios are any indication, I don't think they'll go overboard with the "Grim-n-gritty hyperrealism" thing - if nothing else, BSG owns that niche and no-one else could ever come close, nor should they try.

Finally, would it really be so bad if people take it up as a new fandom. One of my chief delights with Doctor Who, over the past 3 years, has been watching folks get into the new series, then discovering the classic run and enjoying it just as much. The smart fans (which are the only ones we want hanging around, right?) acknowledge their roots. ;)

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

Yes but like I said above, DW is different. He's the same character regenerated and having new adventures; they're not rewriting his old ones. Why would people want to watch a similar plot not done as technically well? We'll be marginalised the way I assume old BSG fans are.

Wait and see

[mossymermaid.livejournal.com]

I wasn't impressed by the new Battlestar until I saw the episodes. Very good. I'm more of a fan of the new series than of the old.

And the reboot of Doctor Who has been a massive improvement (much as I love the classic series some of it was a bit ropey)

Give it a few episodes and see how it goes. It could be very good. And even if its rubbish, it'll direct people to the classic series.

Re: Wait and see

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I really liked BSG S1 despite the stupid camera work which puts up a barrier which says, "Hey look, this is being filmed!" S2 bored me though; why be depressed by entertainment when there's the news?

Doctor Who is a continuation, not the remake they're doing.

remakes

[type-40.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't mind if the characters were remade for the better and not worse.
I read somewhere that Terry was thinking Dirty Harry for Avon. Well, Dirty Harry wasn't: my skin comes first. So that would be nice in my opinion, if Avon were like that.
Maybe tough on Federation punks.
Maybe he could ask Travis if he feels lucky...:)
Actually, in my opinion, if they were all political prisoners on the London, that would be nice.
Rather than the Dirty Dozen in Space. That's not quite what we got either.
From reading fanfic, I get these impressions:
people would like to see Avon and Blake get along
people would like to see them win.

Also, blowing up communication centers, well we should know better now. Even back then, the phone companies could reroute things in a matter of days.
I've read a lot of fanfic where Blake et al go and try to find rebel allies on other planets.
Maybe that kind of story appeals more to women than men, but hey, there are female viewers too.
This time it could be more character driven. And please, don't have the hero thinking of killing innocents just to win.


Also, PD was marketable. I read that B7E says he wasn't.
I think they should do what Doctor Who did with the Master years ago when they found a replacement.
Anthony Ainley...he might have not been as great as Delgado, but he was really close.
So, find someone who looks a bit like PD and get someone who has a velvet voice.
Oh, and fix Vila too. I'd like him like the Vila in City.

Will they pay attention to female fans this time? I wonder.
One thing that B7E said that really made me angry and that was in regards to fanfic: that it was a pale pastiche of the original.
A pastiche is a work that is a hodgepodge of other themes. Well, that is what B7 was if we are really honest with ourselves.
So, this time it could be more original. I've seen it in fanfic. I don't see a lot of imitations of Magnificent 7 or Dirty Dozen in a lot of fanfic writing.

Blake and Avon. Paul once said they were like David and Jonathan. I was thinking more along the lines of Cain and Abel. It could be David and Jonathan this time around though.
Also, what if Avon and Vila were friends this time? Still could have male banter.

So, why am I saying all this? Well, because I keep reading fanfic that does things like this. Or fanfic that tries to fix Avon. What if they were all fixed from the start? Some fanfic does that too.
So I think to myself, pity it wasn't really like that. No psychopathic-like Avon this time please.
Fanfic tries to fix Avon, but I'm not the only one who knows that you can't fix someone who is amoral, you can't fix a psychopath or narcissist.
So, if Terry was thinking Dirty Harry for Avon at one time, then maybe let's have that.
I wonder if PD would agree? Avon is moral but tough on Federation thugs.
Maybe Blake could be the idealist who hopes they can be cured and he and Avon could argue about that so we can have fireworks between the characters again.
Maybe they could argue about how best to defeat the Federation.
So, I wonder if Sewell is thinking anything like that. I doubt he is.
Makes me want to make a fanfic reboot. I wonder if fanfic writers could get together to do one.
Then tell Sewell: hey, this is what we'd like to see. Stop ignoring fans. Also, the Liberator needs a teleport please.

P.S.

[type-40.livejournal.com]

Personally, I don't like Sewell. I don't like Aaronovitch either. The McCoy era of Doctor Who comes to mind. It still makes me shudder. I wish Paul had never ever consulted with those guys.
Frankly, even if fans are not professional writers, I like the stories they tell, they are good stories.
I think things like: let's sack the "professionals" and hire fan writers instead. At least they care and are not thinking about marketing.
Who are they trying to market to? Men? Lets look at what a lot of men like: action with a weak plot. Things blow up and a lot of people die gory deaths in a lot of films aimed at males.
I think it would be nice if sci-fi was aimed more at women and what they like.
I think some changes would need to be made, or we are going to get what we had before, and we know how that ended.
I've seen some guys who think that was cool: yay they all died.
I don't see too many females thinking the ending was fab.

I read some fan comment that said: The Way Back is like a pilot for a different show.
I agree with that.
What if the theme we saw in the Way Back was consistent?
Rather than Saymon in a jar and Kairopan eating ant spiders. Or retconning and giving Gan a limiter so he can't defeat the killer aliens and Jenna has to be the helpless damsel in distress.
Why does Gan have a limiter and other violent criminals don't seem to have one? I wish he never had one.

Some of the stories were a laugh, but is it a political drama or not?
Do we really want or need three nerdy guys called Ultras who are dying to see the "human bonding ritual"? (Maybe some fans do, lol.) Again, it's a laugh, so I guess it depends on how serious you'd like B7 to be.

Re: P.S.

[executrix.livejournal.com]

type_40 said: I don't see too many females thinking the ending was fab.

Me! Me!

Mind you, it's become a bit of a cliche, but they couldn't know that then.

[type-40.livejournal.com]

I would not recommend S4. For one, Terry was not involved in it.
And they could have won, if Vere didn't set them up to fail.
It's the old dismal pessimism. I find it really deux ex machina that Servalan survived Terminal yet the protagonists have bum luck.
I'm a critical fan. Even of my all time favorite: Classic Doctor Who. There's stories I think were great and stories that were really awful.
Sometimes I like the really awful, like Horns of Nimon for a laugh.
But other fans I know would like that story to be burned and never mentioned again. I can understand their point of view.
I respect that.
Happy endings versus tragic endings... To be realistic, one could have a mixed ending. Some make it, some don't. That's more on par with RL.
From what I've read of Terry, he didn't have a grand vision for B7. He threw the idea out there at a meeting. They told him that he had to write the first 13 stories.
So I wonder if he was always under pressure, in a rush.
And he did give PD more control over his character than anyone else.
So, I fight with Meegats who say: Avon wasn't evil, he really cared...
I think he could have, if Terry hadn't been thinking:
Anyone who works with computers has got to be cold and icy.
Must they?
I have never met any cold and icy computer techs. They are typically warm and brilliant in my experience and their place is a mess.
So, maybe Terry didn't know a lot of computer nerds methinks. Computers were probably still a scary concept to a middle aged guy back then. New fangled machines...how could any one work with machines like that?
They must be evil and cold and icy people...yessss. LMAO.

[vandonovan.livejournal.com]

Honestly, I can't get through most of what you're saying, because it makes very little sense. But if they decided to do half of the stuff you're suggesting, the new show WOULD SUCK. What makes B7 so great is that it had such different characters. That it killed everyone at the end. That Avon wasn't nice to anyone. That Blake's Cause made him a bit unstable. That the women were kickass and NOT damsels in distress (I promise you Avon got tied up a lot more often than she ever did). That the president of the galaxy was a woman, that the show was dark and the leads were all condemned criminals. That's what made the story so AWESOME. A cuddly Avon, a good Blake, a n unflawed Vila? These things would be ridiculous and stupid and not B7 at all. Save that stuff for fanfiction PLEASE. I want the reimagining to keep all the characters as they WERE. Just update some of the special effects and tighten up the plots! Don't change the characterizations!

[arenee1999]

No...no...no

Really, one of the reasons I like B7 so much is because of the cast. I don't want to see other actors trying to play those roles. It would only ruin it for me.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't mind if they did it well, but they haven't so far in the audios.

For example, Martin Freeman as Vila would be awesome and still very him, and I think Dylan Moran would be a brilliant Avon if he can do an English accent. But they'll 'reimagine' all of them. :-(

[type-40.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry if you can't make out what I'm saying. I assumed other fans read interviews from Terry Nation and so on.
Terry Nation was not happy with series 4. Some of us think it sucked, that the characters were made into two dimensional characatures of their former selves.
If you like the way it ended, then why do you want a remake?
Some of the actors, like Keating complained about how their characters were portrayed.
However, if you think everything was perfect, then who cares if they do a remake?
As for Avon, no he wasn't nice. Some fan girls think he was though and they write stories were Avon cared after all.
So no, I am not the only one who likes that. Maybe you think that notion sucks, others don't. It's a matter of personal opinion.
I figure if everyone was happy with the way the the story arcs in the show went, they wouldn't write fanfic AUs.
However, I am not going to shout and act rude and type in all caps just to make my point.

[vandonovan.livejournal.com]

People write fanfiction for stories they love, not just they want to "fix" something. An AU where they're all police detectives in the 1930s has nothing to do with liking or disliking the ending of the series. I LOVE THE ENDING and I still write stories set after the series where they live. you know why? Because it's easier to write stories about LIVING PEOPLE than dead ones. But I still wouldn't WANT the ending to change.

You are putting words in my mouth. What Terry Nation wanted and what happened are not relevant and cannot be used in this arguement, sorry.

Also, "If you liked the way it ended, then why do you want a remake." What? Why not? I love the original series. I would also love to see how they handle it with a larger budget! Just because your car from 1980 still runs, why should you get a new one? Just because that dress from 1970 still fits, why buy new clothes?

I don't think the original series was perfect. Far from it. But I like the STORYLINE it told, and I wouldn't want to see that changed. I wouldn't want to see them live at the end. I wouldn't want to see Avon not kill Blake. I wouldn't want to see Avon not go insane in S4. I wouldn't want it to end after Terminal. But I think it could be updated interestingly. (I also think they could ruin it, but I'm willing to stand back and see where they go with it.)

You are welcome to your opinion, but be aware that I am also welcome to mine. Right now, the way you are talking, you are making gross generalizations for most of fandom, and that is unfair.

Wait and See

[kerravonsen]

1) It may not even happen.
2) It may be a sequel rather than a remake. A sequel would be better than a remake, because they wouldn't be trying to re-interpret the original.
3) If it's a remake, then that does not change the goodness of the original. The original is still intact..
3a) Fans of the original are not going to suddenly dislike it.
3b) People may discover the original because of the new one. How is that bad? Because either they will like it, and there will be new souls for the faith, or they will dislike it, which will be absolutely no loss, because they would never have liked it in the first place.
4) Whatever the case, I will be judging it on its own merits, treating it as a completely different show with no connection to the original except for a similar backstory. That's what I've done with other things:
- BSG: new BSG is completely different in tone from the original. I remember when people were all up in arms about how Starbuck was being recast as a female, but that turned out not to be horrible like people feared; they're just different characters. I was very impressed with the mini-series, but decided for various reasons not to continue with the series.
- Tomorrow People: the new series has the same premise as the original series, but is set later, with different characters. I consider them to be parallel universes, though others see the NS as a continuation of the OS. I like them both.
- Doctor Who: New Who being a continuation rather than a remake, but I think it works. I love them both. There are times when I want to strangle RTD, but other times when I want to cheer.
- Tin Man: again, this is a sequel rather than a remake. I haven't watched it myself yet, but I've heard a lot of good things about it.
- And how many different versions of "The Scarlet Pimpernel" or "Pride and Predjudice" are there? The good ones are good, and the crappy ones are crappy, and the crappiness of the crappy ones doesn't make the good ones bad.
Of course, there have been other remakes that I've heard bad things about and simply haven't bothered watching.

No matter what happens, B7 will still be B7.

Re: Wait and See

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I'd be more open-minded if it wasn't B7E. Their audios were OOC, the universe was changed, and the FOley work so bad I couldn't work out what was going on. This does not bode well.

[type-40.livejournal.com]

Yeah, well you don't need to write in all caps unless you intended to shout.
With this remake with Sewell, there are already audios that B7E made.
The characters are already different from what we got in the original.
The story lines have already been changed and some other major things as well. Such as: the Liberator does not have a teleport.
So, maybe write to Sewell because he's already messed with the original.
As for the original series, female cast members left. Reading interviews as to why they left is rather interesting.
An old interview with Paul Darrow said: Sally got tired of being the "dolly bird of the series." But that's what she was, a sort of Farah Fawcett Majors."
Well, I guess Sally did not like that, so we lost her. We lost Jan Chappel as well.
Anyway, none of this probably matters, because if Sewell does what he did with the B7 Audios, the characters will most likely be very different.

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I think this is meant to be in reply to Van.

[imhilien.livejournal.com]

Ooh, a remake... I guess I will be hoping for the best (and part fearing the worst).

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

I would be too if it wasn't B7E.

[mistraltoes.livejournal.com]

It is Not Canon, and We Shall Ignore It*. We have Spoken. And no young whippersnappers shall chase Us out of Our Home Fandom. We invite You to be part of Us**. :)


[*Unless it is very, very good.]

[**And since You are mod of several B7 communities, You are in far better position to slap the young whippersnappers into line than We are. Rejoice in Maximum Power!]

::bewails lack of appropriately snooty Servalan icon::

[vilakins.livejournal.com]

Ha! I can make you one if you like. :-D